Battle System: Action Points and Skill Points

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    Belmont

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    Battle System: Action Points and Skill Points

    Post by Belmont on Sun Jul 03, 2011 4:03 am

    This is just an idea that I had and it might not be implemented in Vampire Hunt at all. Feel free to discuss and improve the system. Still under construction.

    Action Points

    Action Points (or AP for short) are required to use offensive actions. At the beginning of a party's turn all characters of that party will regenerate some AP (which is calculated by [STATS]+d20) unless that character is affected by a condition that does not allow him to have a turn (for example: stunned, frozen, incapacitated). Action Points CAN go below zero if an ability is used that requires more AP than a character currently has.

    Action Points can be affected by spells or abilities. This means that they be negative when an AP draining ability is used. AP regeneration can be affected when an ability is used that affects the opponents AP regeneration by lowering it or casting a buff that increases an ally's regeneration. It is also possible to completely stop AP regeneration by applying conditions to an enemy that stop that character from having a turn.

    The maximum amount of Action Points a character can have stored at any moment is 300 AP. In order to take an action during your turn you need at least 50 AP.

    Cost of Actions

    0 AP:
    Wait. (Can only be used if you do not take an action during your turn. Transfers your turn to another character)

    50 AP:
    Using Items. (Consuming items such as potions or using items such as jewels or runes)
    Switch Items. (Switching between two weapons or giving an item to a character)
    Switch Position. (Switching position with another character)
    Prepare. (Action required to use [Clash]. You prepare for an incoming attack, can be used for yourself or to cover. Does not transfer your turn to the next player)

    75 AP:
    Very weak Master spells and abilities.

    100 AP:
    Basic Attack.
    Weaker Master spells and abilities.

    150 AP:
    Most Master spells and abilities fall under this category.

    200 AP:
    Very powerful Master spells and abilities. Some weaker Servant level spells and abilities.

    250 to 800 AP:
    Noble Phantasms or Servant level spells and abilities.

    1000 AP:
    EX-Rank ability, spell or Noble Phantasm.

    Skill Points

    Skill Points (or SP for short) are used to activate an ability or spell. During a party's turn all characters of that party will gain 1 SP, even when affected by a condition that would not allow them to regenerate AP. A maximum of 5 SP can be stored. Every ability or spell will have a SP cost associated to it in addition to an AP cost.

    Example:
    Excalibur [Rank A++ Noble Phantasm] 800 AP | 4 SP
    Invisible Air [Rank C Noble Phantasm] 250 AP | 2 SP
    Avalon [Rank EX Noble Phantasm] 1000 AP | 5 SP

    Saber has 300 AP and 4 SP in total. During her turn she could either attack three times, use Invisible Air or use Invisible Air and attack once. Saber would be able to use Excalibur because she has enough SP available but her AP will be negative for several turns, not allowing her to take any offensive actions. If Saber uses all her AP during this turn she would have a lot less AP available for her next turn because she only regenerates 100+d20 AP every turn. It is important to decide how to spend your AP and SP in a battle.

    Turns

    In Vampire Hunt there will always be two parties fighting against each other, a player party and an enemy party. Turn order will not be individual like the current system. Instead all characters of a party will take actions. Once a party has taken all its actions the turn will be transferred over to the second party. The party that takes its actions second will gain one extra SP during its first turn. The party that has the first turn order will be decided by several factors (yet to be decided) but factors such as an ambush will always gain the first turn.

    In a party (which has a limit of 9 characters for now) a maximum of 5 characters will be able to take an action. The characters that are able to take an action are decided by highest to lowest AP. Remember, you need at least 50 AP to take an action. This means that in some cases less than 5 players might be able to take an action. It is possible to transfer your action turn to another character by using [Wait] if no action is taken.

    Defending

    Defending will be very similar to the current form of defending, that means, that defending against an attack will not be part of your turn. However, there will be some slight modifications.

    [Evade] will not consume any AP nor any SP unless an ability or spell is used.
    [Defend] will not consume any AP nor any SP unless an ability or spell is used. Using a defensive piece of equipment (such as your weapon) will be free.
    [Clash] will always consume AP and SP as it is the most powerful option to defend against an attack. In order to use [Clash] you will need to use [Prepare] during your turn (more information about this action above). Because [Clash] now has hefty costs and requirements all current penalties for its use are removed.
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    Lucid
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    Re: Battle System: Action Points and Skill Points

    Post by Lucid on Thu Jul 07, 2011 2:34 am

    Lots of things to ponder. Guess I'll try to write something about my idea while quoting yours.



    Action Points
    Action Points (or AP for short) are required to use offensive actions. At the beginning of a party's turn all characters of that party will regenerate some AP (which is calculated by [STATS]+d20) unless that character is affected by a condition that does not allow him to have a turn (for example: stunned, frozen, incapacitated). Action Points CAN go below zero if an ability is used that requires more AP than a character currently has.

    Action Points can be affected by spells or abilities. This means that they be negative when an AP draining ability is used. AP regeneration can be affected when an ability is used that affects the opponents AP regeneration by lowering it or casting a buff that increases an ally's regeneration. It is also possible to completely stop AP regeneration by applying conditions to an enemy that stop that character from having a turn.

    The maximum amount of Action Points a character can have stored at any moment is 300 AP. In order to take an action during your turn you need at least 50 AP.

    The idea I had was that each character has set amount of action points each turn. Agility kind of stats would increase it. Lets say some very basic character would have 1-2 action points and Dead Apostle around 4. You always have that amount of AP during start of turn unless some status effect changes it.



    Cost of Actions
    0 AP:
    Wait. (Can only be used if you do not take an action during your turn. Transfers your turn to another character)

    50 AP:
    Using Items. (Consuming items such as potions or using items such as jewels or runes)
    Switch Items. (Switching between two weapons or giving an item to a character)
    Switch Position. (Switching position with another character)
    Prepare. (Action required to use [Clash]. You prepare for an incoming attack, can be used for yourself or to cover. Does not transfer your turn to the next player)

    75 AP:
    Very weak Master spells and abilities.

    100 AP:
    Basic Attack.
    Weaker Master spells and abilities.

    [ETC]


    My thoughts were pretty same. 1 Action point for normal attacks and more action points for more powerful attacks. If the ability would cost lets say 8 action points you need to spent points each turn to prepare for it. You had some interesting ideas like Switching Items, and Prepare.


    Skill Points
    Skill Points (or SP for short) are used to activate an ability or spell. During a party's turn all characters of that party will gain 1 SP, even when affected by a condition that would not allow them to regenerate AP. A maximum of 5 SP can be stored. Every ability or spell will have a SP cost associated to it in addition to an AP cost.

    Example:
    Excalibur [Rank A++ Noble Phantasm] 800 AP | 4 SP
    Invisible Air [Rank C Noble Phantasm] 250 AP | 2 SP
    Avalon [Rank EX Noble Phantasm] 1000 AP | 5 SP

    [ETC]


    One more parameter to keep track of. Hopefully this won't become a problem. Also I just thought but another Fate system I read uses things called Luck points to affect the game and activate powerful abilities. Maybe we could bring the Luck stat back and give it some additional effects. In the system each character had set amount of Luck points per campaign. If they were used they were very hard to regain with set conditions. In a sense they were like mini command spells.


    Turns
    In Vampire Hunt there will always be two parties fighting against each other, a player party and an enemy party. Turn order will not be individual like the current system. Instead all characters of a party will take actions. Once a party has taken all its actions the turn will be transferred over to the second party. The party that takes its actions second will gain one extra SP during its first turn. The party that has the first turn order will be decided by several factors (yet to be decided) but factors such as an ambush will always gain the first turn.

    In a party (which has a limit of 9 characters for now) a maximum of 5 characters will be able to take an action. The characters that are able to take an action are decided by highest to lowest AP. Remember, you need at least 50 AP to take an action. This means that in some cases less than 5 players might be able to take an action. It is possible to transfer your action turn to another character by using [Wait] if no action is taken.



    Two parties fighting might not be entirely true. Don't wanna spoil anything yet. Also I was thinking of an invidual battle system for Vampire Hunt too. I'm not sure how the game would build around the setting of two or more parties trading blows. I need some to think about this.



    Defending
    Defending will be very similar to the current form of defending, that means, that defending against an attack will not be part of your turn. However, there will be some slight modifications.

    [Evade] will not consume any AP nor any SP unless an ability or spell is used.
    [Defend] will not consume any AP nor any SP unless an ability or spell is used. Using a defensive piece of equipment (such as your weapon) will be free.
    [Clash] will always consume AP and SP as it is the most powerful option to defend against an attack. In order to use [Clash] you will need to use [Prepare] during your turn (more information about this action above). Because [Clash] now has hefty costs and requirements all current penalties for its use are removed.


    The clashing system was originally built because of Noble Phantasms. I was thinking of making Clash a purchasable skill with different restrictions.
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    Belmont

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    Re: Battle System: Action Points and Skill Points

    Post by Belmont on Thu Jul 07, 2011 12:28 pm

    The idea I had was that each character has set amount of action points each turn. Agility kind of stats would increase it. Lets say some very basic character would have 1-2 action points and Dead Apostle around 4. You always have that amount of AP during start of turn unless some status effect changes it.

    My thoughts were pretty same. 1 Action point for normal attacks and more action points for more powerful attacks. If the ability would cost lets say 8 action points you need to spent points each turn to prepare for it. You had some interesting ideas like Switching Items, and Prepare.


    I believe that your system is a lot simpler and a lot easier to keep track of with the same benefits. Would there be a limit on the maximum of AP you can store or would it be impossible to store AP? Actions such as Switch Item and Prepare could be 'Half Actions' as seen here (http://rulebreaker.forums-rpg.com/download.forum?id=15). The biggest problem with the very first system was that defensive actions were linked to your APs so a Master had little chances of surviving a Servant using all actions to attack the Master but I believe you intend to keep the current defend system so that problem would be solved.

    One more parameter to keep track of. Hopefully this won't become a problem. Also I just thought but another Fate system I read uses things called Luck points to affect the game and activate powerful abilities. Maybe we could bring the Luck stat back and give it some additional effects. In the system each character had set amount of Luck points per campaign. If they were used they were very hard to regain with set conditions. In a sense they were like mini command spells.

    Skill Point would always be gained at the same rate for all characters so they are quite easy to keep track of and they would limit very powerful abilities. I don't quite like 'luck points' because the restriction they impose is very heavy and player's might switch to abilities that don't use 'luck points' to avoid facing a situation where they are unable to use that ability due to lack of 'luck points' but meet all other prerequisites.

    Two parties fighting might not be entirely true. Don't wanna spoil anything yet. Also I was thinking of an invidual battle system for Vampire Hunt too. I'm not sure how the game would build around the setting of two or more parties trading blows. I need some to think about this.

    I'm glad individual combat is still present in one way or another because I thought it would be extremely rare to non existent in Vampire Hunt.

    The clashing system was originally built because of Noble Phantasms. I was thinking of making Clash a purchasable skill with different restrictions.

    Maybe instead of a skill it should be an attribute you can attach to a weapon, spell or ability? If attached to an item, losing that item would be a considerable disadvantage.
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    Corenat Rovarnus

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    Re: Battle System: Action Points and Skill Points

    Post by Corenat Rovarnus on Fri Feb 03, 2012 1:14 pm

    About that if the maximum amount of AP a character can store is 300, how are servants going to use the Servant abilities and Noble Phantasms?

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    Re: Battle System: Action Points and Skill Points

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